|
Post by Pacelli on Apr 30, 2023 7:40:30 GMT -5
The Apostolicity of the Church – Who are the Successors of the Apostles?, S.D. Wright, published on April 20, 2023 Link to article on the W.M. Review website: HERE
|
|
|
Post by Didymus on May 1, 2023 12:49:06 GMT -5
I was reading the articles, nothing more than excellent and well summarized, I have shared it with other sedevacantes. But I have a question about the second article related to this, here is the link: wmreview.co.uk/2023/04/27/ordinary-jurisdiction/#_ftn14 Ordinary jurisdiction. In the article they mention the following: "There are some texts and authors which appear to suggest that non-residential bishops also succeed to this pastoral office by virtue of their consecration. The study of Abbé Dutertre (already mentioned) discusses the problems with this idea.[13] The conclusion which he presents (and which I follow) on this particular issue can be summarised in the thesis of Wilmers:
“Besides the jurisdiction given to them by the supreme Pontiff the bishops do not have any other universal jurisdiction given to them by Christ as the members of the apostolic college continued through them.”[14]
There are some who will strongly disagree with this. For the little that it is worth, Wilmer’s arguments (quoted extensively in Abbé Dutertre’s study) seem decisive to me.
However, regardless of whether the so-called “traditional bishops” of our times might be said to be, somehow, successors of the apostles as well, it remains true at any rate that residential bishops are constituted as successors of the apostles by virtue of the ordinary jurisdiction proper to their office. It is this that enables them to teach and govern their particular churches, as well as to sanctify their subjects through the power of orders.""
I do not know the work of Abbé Dutertre, but I have read some things about him I believe in this forum and that he has some errors, especially with the apostolic succession. Could you help me understand this a bit, and Dutertre's position? ""The conclusion which he presents (and which I follow) on this particular issue can be summarised in the thesis of Wilmers:
“Besides the jurisdiction given to them by the supreme Pontiff the bishops do not have any other universal jurisdiction given to them by Christ as the members of the apostolic college continued through them.”[14]
There are some who will strongly disagree with this. For the little that it is worth, Wilmer’s arguments (quoted extensively in Abbé Dutertre’s study) seem decisive to me.""" I think I'm missing Abbe's argument,And I don't understand what SD WRIGHT is referring to here, Thank you Pacelli.
|
|
Caillin
Approved Cath Resource contributor
Posts: 136
|
Post by Caillin on May 1, 2023 14:43:19 GMT -5
I was reading the articles, nothing more than excellent and well summarized, I have shared it with other sedevacantes. But I have a question about the second article related to this, here is the link: wmreview.co.uk/2023/04/27/ordinary-jurisdiction/#_ftn14 Ordinary jurisdiction. In the article they mention the following: "There are some texts and authors which appear to suggest that non-residential bishops also succeed to this pastoral office by virtue of their consecration. The study of Abbé Dutertre (already mentioned) discusses the problems with this idea.[13] The conclusion which he presents (and which I follow) on this particular issue can be summarised in the thesis of Wilmers:
“Besides the jurisdiction given to them by the supreme Pontiff the bishops do not have any other universal jurisdiction given to them by Christ as the members of the apostolic college continued through them.”[14]
There are some who will strongly disagree with this. For the little that it is worth, Wilmer’s arguments (quoted extensively in Abbé Dutertre’s study) seem decisive to me.
However, regardless of whether the so-called “traditional bishops” of our times might be said to be, somehow, successors of the apostles as well, it remains true at any rate that residential bishops are constituted as successors of the apostles by virtue of the ordinary jurisdiction proper to their office. It is this that enables them to teach and govern their particular churches, as well as to sanctify their subjects through the power of orders.""
I do not know the work of Abbé Dutertre, but I have read some things about him I believe in this forum and that he has some errors, especially with the apostolic succession. Could you help me understand this a bit, and Dutertre's position? ""The conclusion which he presents (and which I follow) on this particular issue can be summarised in the thesis of Wilmers:
“Besides the jurisdiction given to them by the supreme Pontiff the bishops do not have any other universal jurisdiction given to them by Christ as the members of the apostolic college continued through them.”[14]
There are some who will strongly disagree with this. For the little that it is worth, Wilmer’s arguments (quoted extensively in Abbé Dutertre’s study) seem decisive to me.""" I think I'm missing Abbe's argument,And I don't understand what SD WRIGHT is referring to here, Thank you Pacelli. SD Wright is referring to Abbé Dutertre's study, "On Collegiality": mostholytrinityseminary.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Collegiality_Dutertre_2023.pdfIn particular, see the sections addressing Bolgeni's novel teaching on jurisdiction (pp.10-11, obj.10; pp.68-83)
|
|
|
Post by Didymus on May 1, 2023 20:03:49 GMT -5
I was reading the articles, nothing more than excellent and well summarized, I have shared it with other sedevacantes. But I have a question about the second article related to this, here is the link: wmreview.co.uk/2023/04/27/ordinary-jurisdiction/#_ftn14 Ordinary jurisdiction. In the article they mention the following: "There are some texts and authors which appear to suggest that non-residential bishops also succeed to this pastoral office by virtue of their consecration. The study of Abbé Dutertre (already mentioned) discusses the problems with this idea.[13] The conclusion which he presents (and which I follow) on this particular issue can be summarised in the thesis of Wilmers:
“Besides the jurisdiction given to them by the supreme Pontiff the bishops do not have any other universal jurisdiction given to them by Christ as the members of the apostolic college continued through them.”[14]
There are some who will strongly disagree with this. For the little that it is worth, Wilmer’s arguments (quoted extensively in Abbé Dutertre’s study) seem decisive to me.
However, regardless of whether the so-called “traditional bishops” of our times might be said to be, somehow, successors of the apostles as well, it remains true at any rate that residential bishops are constituted as successors of the apostles by virtue of the ordinary jurisdiction proper to their office. It is this that enables them to teach and govern their particular churches, as well as to sanctify their subjects through the power of orders.""
I do not know the work of Abbé Dutertre, but I have read some things about him I believe in this forum and that he has some errors, especially with the apostolic succession. Could you help me understand this a bit, and Dutertre's position? ""The conclusion which he presents (and which I follow) on this particular issue can be summarised in the thesis of Wilmers:
“Besides the jurisdiction given to them by the supreme Pontiff the bishops do not have any other universal jurisdiction given to them by Christ as the members of the apostolic college continued through them.”[14]
There are some who will strongly disagree with this. For the little that it is worth, Wilmer’s arguments (quoted extensively in Abbé Dutertre’s study) seem decisive to me.""" I think I'm missing Abbe's argument,And I don't understand what SD WRIGHT is referring to here, Thank you Pacelli. SD Wright is referring to Abbé Dutertre's study, "On Collegiality": mostholytrinityseminary.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Collegiality_Dutertre_2023.pdfIn particular, see the sections addressing Bolgeni's novel teaching on jurisdiction (pp.10-11, obj.10; pp.68-83) That has been enough, it has become very clear to me, thank you Caillin (I speak Spanish, sometimes I do not have to translate such long texts), but this had generated doubts in me, but it has answered everything.
|
|